Doctor Who season 8.

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Doctor Who season 8.

Wayne
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I have to say I'm enjoying Capaldi very much as the Doctor, but I'm not really liking the stories.  The political agendas that are really being force fed are taking away the enjoyment for me.  In the first episode it was the gay marriage bit over and over and over again.  I'm beginning to groan whenever we get a Vastra and Jenny episode, which is a shame because they are two of my favorite characters in the last few years.

This weeks episode really gets under my skin.  It's wrong to hate Daleks?!  They are a race of beings who have done nothing but kill and destroy, and it's wrong to hate them?  Clara called him prejudiced and slaps him over it.  Is it supposed to be analogous to muslims?  That's what I got out of it.  It's not okay to dislike a people who are bent on destruction and genocide.  But it's okay to dislike someone who is a soldier and fighting to keep others safe?  I'm confused by this.  The belittling of soldiers is really grinding my gears.  Why can't people keep their politics out of it?  I'm very curious to hear from Brian, who I guarantee had a different take.
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Re: Doctor Who season 8.

milkman (Ian)
I agree with everything you said Wayne. I also hated how they kept telling us how stupid we were for not being thrilled with an old doctor, at least in the first episode. I'm okay with the dude but I hate being told that I'm supposed to be or I'm an idiot, or somehow some bad person for having an original thought. It came across as a bit of bullying. I think I'm out.
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Re: Doctor Who season 8.

Secret Identity
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In reply to this post by Wayne
I wouldn't say I have a different take, just a more general one. What I took away from the first episode was that people tend to make things that are not about them all about them. Clara was so concerned with how she felt about the Doctor changing and no longer being her doctor, that she didn't stop to think about what he was going through.

And the Vastra and Jenny stuff was a bit heavy handed, but I think the general message was "what gives you the right to judge anyone else?" The part that I find heavy handed is when they delve into the romance between Vastra and Jenny. Don't get we wrong, I could watch a whole show about the two of them and their adventures, but it was a distraction in that episode. It's already been well established that they love one another.

As for the second episode, I thought the general theme was that there are no absolutes. If you only think one way about a group of people or a particular idea, you leave no possibility open for any exceptions. Doctor Who couldn't accept the concept of a "good" Dalek.

Overall though, I agree with your first statement. It's the stories that have been lackluster. But for me, it's not the political messages, it's the fact that they're not very exciting, which is an even bigger problem. It's Doctor Who--it should never be boring.


Wayne wrote
I have to say I'm enjoying Capaldi very much as the Doctor, but I'm not really liking the stories.  The political agendas that are really being force fed are taking away the enjoyment for me.  In the first episode it was the gay marriage bit over and over and over again.  I'm beginning to groan whenever we get a Vastra and Jenny episode, which is a shame because they are two of my favorite characters in the last few years.

This weeks episode really gets under my skin.  It's wrong to hate Daleks?!  They are a race of beings who have done nothing but kill and destroy, and it's wrong to hate them?  Clara called him prejudiced and slaps him over it.  Is it supposed to be analogous to muslims?  That's what I got out of it.  It's not okay to dislike a people who are bent on destruction and genocide.  But it's okay to dislike someone who is a soldier and fighting to keep others safe?  I'm confused by this.  The belittling of soldiers is really grinding my gears.  Why can't people keep their politics out of it?  I'm very curious to hear from Brian, who I guarantee had a different take.
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Re: Doctor Who season 8.

Wayne
In reply to this post by milkman (Ian)
milkman (Ian) wrote
I also hated how they kept telling us how stupid we were for not being thrilled with an old doctor, at least in the first episode.
Matt Smith brought a lot of young girls into Doctor Who.  That whole bit about Clara not being sure about the Doctor, I think, was targeted at those girls.  Especially the scene with Matt Smith on the phone at the end.
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Re: Doctor Who season 8.

Wayne
In reply to this post by Secret Identity
Secret Identity wrote
As for the second episode, I thought the general theme was that there are no absolutes. If you only think one way about a group of people or a particular idea, you leave no possibility open for any exceptions. Doctor Who couldn't accept the concept of a "good" Dalek.
There was also no understanding from Clara.  The Daleks have been shown as an absolute from the beginning.  They have never done anything but destroy, and as we see in 50th, they've caused the Doctor to put aside his morals and fight a war.  Clara came off as self righteous.  I can't wait for her to leave.  And I have to say I think Danny Pink could be a great companion.  I can totally relate with the scene of him banging his head on the desk.  I'm very curious about him.

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Re: Doctor Who season 8.

Secret Identity
Administrator
For me, that goes back to the writing. I think the premise of the episode was interesting, but outside of a few lines of dialogue, it was poorly executed.

I think if the writers had a little more faith in their audience, the themes of each episode wouldn't need to be repeated ad nauseum.

For example, wouldn't it have been better if the episode had asked the question once and then let you as the viewer think about the idea of whether a Dalek could actually be good. But they're not letting us process the information and reflect on it, because they're repeating the question over and over.

The same with the first episode. Vastra could have called out Clara on her being judgmental and let that sit with the viewer.




Wayne wrote
There was also no understanding from Clara.  The Daleks have been shown as an absolute from the beginning.  They have never done anything but destroy, and as we see in 50th, they've caused the Doctor to put aside his morals and fight a war.  Clara came off as self righteous.
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Re: Doctor Who season 8.

Wayne
"Listen"

I don't know what to think of this episode.  For the most part I liked it.  But the ending felt a little decpetive.  Because Clara went back in time and caused The Doctor's fear of the dark, are we to assume that it was another kid under the blanket?  Because that feels like a cheat, but I also kind of like it.  My favorite part was the Doctor's little speech on fear being a super power.

If the barn that the Doctor as a child was hiding in is the same barn from the Day of the Doctor, then wouldn't they be on Gallifrey?  How the heck did the TARDIS land on Gallifrey?  It's time locked.  It was put in another dimension.


Interesting bits from the barn scene:
-He is in some kind of orphanage.
    -If his parents are gone, who were the two people who had to cover their faces in Tennant episodes?
-The kid, assumed to be The Doctor, has a tendency to run away.
-There are expectations of him becoming a soldier and he doesn't want to.
-He is not expected to get into the Academy to become a Time Lord.
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Re: Doctor Who season 8.

airsblue
In reply to this post by Wayne
Doctor Who - Listen

I regret watching this before bed.  Moffat showed he can make something as scary as “Blink.”

We start off with the Doctor obsessing over the idea of perfect camouflage.  He had not seen the “Star Trek: The Next Generation” episode Identity Crisis and its scary answer.

I liked all the Doctor's mile-a-minute talk.

I liked the looks the Doctor and Oswald shared.

I like Oswald's growing realization and apprehension about the seemingly inevitable course her life will take.
Time travel – always accidentally messing up peoples' lives.

I am pleased we received an explanation about why the War Doctor went to that sack to set off The Moment.  
I am puzzled that a civilization that manipulates stars had any spot that looked like 1800s Earth.

We agree that there was no camouflaged alien and that the Doctor's subconscious had him write 'Listen' on the chalkboard?

Other people had fun with this episode:  Actor David Hewlett and son.
https://twitter.com/dhewlett/status/511306365823098880
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Re: Doctor Who season 8.

Wayne
In reply to this post by Wayne
They can't stop themselves can they.  "Kill The Moon" should have been titled "The Abortion Episode".  Once again I could not enjoy the show because of the political propaganda being pushed on me.  The Doctor leaves three females (because a man has no say if a woman has an abortion) to make the "choice" of if they murder a baby.  Clara asks "the world" if it's okay to kill the baby.  "The world" says yes, it's okay.  Then Clara doesn't do it anyway.  So what I hear them saying is "abortion is a woman's choice, but you probably shouldn't".

I think I will not be watching next weeks episode.
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Re: Doctor Who season 8.

Secret Identity
Administrator
Wayne wrote
They can't stop themselves can they.  "Kill The Moon" should have been titled "The Abortion Episode".  Once again I could not enjoy the show because of the political propaganda being pushed on me.  The Doctor leaves three females (because a man has no say if a woman has an abortion) to make the "choice" of if they murder a baby.  Clara asks "the world" if it's okay to kill the baby.  "The world" says yes, it's okay.  Then Clara doesn't do it anyway.  So what I hear them saying is "abortion is a woman's choice, but you probably shouldn't".

I think I will not be watching next weeks episode.
I'm three episodes behind on the show this season. But I've seen a lot of discussion online about this episode.

What's interesting to me is that the show seems to be taking on these hot-button issues this season, in the midst of also trying to introduce a new doctor. Makes me wonder if they thought tackling these issues would help ease the new doctor in, because the issues are taking center stage. Kind of seems like it's backfiring, though.
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Re: Doctor Who season 8.

airsblue
whitechocolatespaceegg, someone is a Liz Phair fan.  Ride is a great song.


I saw a repeated theme of misjudging an alien, as in "Time Heist."
'Don't care what the back story is, it is hurting people.  Make it stop.'

I was surprised that the Doctor pushed Clara too far the very next episode.

It was a neat shot having the world turn out the lights.

I thought for sure we were going to see the birth of the space whale from the 2010 season.

This was the darkest the Doctor Who universe has been since "Children of Earth."  No wonder the Doctor turns away sometimes.
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Re: Doctor Who season 8.

airsblue
In reply to this post by Secret Identity
Flatline.
This was great.  2D invaders.  Not funny as in "Space Dandy," but scary monsters.  Human level intelligence, just different from 3D people.  Judging 3D people as inferior I think.  Defiantly a foothold going on.

Lots of classic horror scenes.  Limping, disfigured, love ones that are no longer the people you knew.  Killing off nice people like the policewoman.  Isolation of a group of people.   Some random guy who has always wanted to do something questionably legal, like ram a train.

Balanced by the funny.  The Doctor being a full sized man in a tiny box.   A parody of a small man in a box?
Him passing things to Clara out of her purse and poking his head out was hilarious.  
Funny gag pulling "An Addams Family."